catbar (catbar) wrote in asimov_fanfic,

A genderfree possessive-pronoun for Daneel

Daneel can't see the point - therefore the rationality - of being a particular gender.      Daneel is just - Daneel.      A Being, dammit.    

Any suggestions for a genderless possessive-pronoun comprehensible by Earther Anglo speakers.....?   
The Solarians have gone completely hermie.    The proudly genderblind Aurorans have one but it's unpronouncable by Anglo speakers.   Or perhaps - to Earthers -  it sounds like a rude word......    Most things sound 'rude' to Earthers as they're a h-phobic genderbound lot of bigots.     And they're also anti-robot, but again, they're pretty anti-anything that's not acceptable to their culture.      Being, to them, is just not man enough (!).
 Pic of 'Daneel'
"I just wanna be free-e.  O-oh I just wanna be free".   Geddit?

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Some commonly used gender-neutral pronouns for english speakers are ze and sie (hir, hirs). Or you could just use "they", which used to be a gender-neutral singular pronoun.

I think a genderqueer Daneel is a brilliant idea. Good luck with your story.
Hello Silver_Sandals, and many thanks for your informative message! If that's OK with you I might use these for my fic writing.

Do you do any writing fics yourself? (Especially Asimov-inspired fics).

I often do use 'they' as a gender-neutral singular pronoun when referring to someone whose gender I either can't decide on, or just don't want to reveal (usually when I feel it doesn't matter).

Actually 'my' Daneel mostly goes about as, and is described in my narrative as, an actual male - simply to show that males too are entitled to be and do anything that females (well, western females that is) are allowed to. But, as a humaniform robot, Daneel can also re-gender when necessary.

So it's a sort of 'why not' attitude. Such as 'if females are free to wear their hair long or short, and dress in nice colourful flowing romantic clothes or just wear jeans and leather jackets, and can openly show affection to each other without fear of ridicule, and admit to fear or sadness, etc, then so can we males! (And, what's more, they DO).

In my fic the 'Daneel types' can be almost militantly liberated and come from a 'first-come first-served' culture, where, whether one is genetically female or male simply doesn't come in to it. It's what I call a 'women, men and children' society (the men getting included for once!)

Sorry, this HAS gone on rather! It's one of my pet 'vents'.
Oh, sure, use them away! That's why I posted after all ;)

The pronouns I mentioned are the ones commonly used in queer/social justice groups. My one other suggestion to you would be to read up a little bit on human gender identity before you write a nonhuman genderqueer character. That way you avoid offending anyone and your story will feel more realistic. But I think you've definitely got some good ideas about exploring these subjects in the Asimov-verse.

(one quick tip to remember: there are human genders outside of male, female, both, and neither. I'm just an ally though so you might be better off reading what others have written on the subject. If you want I'd be happy to look up some good starting points for you, but you can probably find a lot just by googling.)

And no, I haven't written any Asimov fic yet, although I'm feeling some plot bunnies creeping up on me. I am a moderately prolific ficcer and vidder, mostly for Doctor Who and X-Men comics, and also for lots of other random things. I think we've talked before- you might remember me as celticfox on Or you might not. It was a while ago. I'm sort of hoping you don't, as this is my new, grown-up persona.)
Actually - though, from what you say, you might not want to hear this - I DO remember you as 'Celticfox', as you left a very appreciative comment on one of my very OOC Asimov fics! (So, it's a good memory for me at any rate!)

Many thanks again for your tips and suggestion, and offer of looking up things for me. Maybe you could point me to any particularly good sites or blogs or forums on human gender identity? I most certainly would NOT want to give offense to anyone or group.

It never occurred to me that you were 'rude' at any time, so please don't worry. Im quite a loner and don't ally myself to any particular group - nor do I have any sort of partner - but I'd always champion any sort of genderfree issue as I HATE unjust and bigoted discrimination!!!

Maybe I'd make a 'good Solarian' (if you've read Asimov's Robot Novels....).
Oh, goodness, and I just realized I took the liberty of assuming you were cisgendered and/or unfamiliar with queer theory! That was terribly rude of me, and I apologize. I'm still learning too.